Angela in Ontario 🇨🇦

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: There are human beings out here who want to die so bad. No one wants to talk about the reasons why.

[00:00:06] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just shut right out and what a beautiful op. I can take this pill if I want to kill myself.

[00:00:12] [SPEAKER_01]: No one's gonna know that it was suicide.

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Hey there, my name is Sean and this is Suicide Noted. On this podcast I can't even remember

[00:00:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Hey there, my name is Sean and this is Suicide Noted. On this podcast I talk about suicide attempt

[00:00:49] [SPEAKER_00]: survivors so that we can hear their stories. Every year around the world millions of people

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_00]: try to take their own lives and we almost never talk about it. We certainly don't talk about it

[00:00:56] [SPEAKER_00]: enough. When we do talk about it many of us including me we're not very good at it. So one

[00:01:01] [SPEAKER_00]: of my goals with this podcast is to have more conversations and hopefully better conversations

[00:01:06] [SPEAKER_00]: with attempt survivors in large part to help more people in more places hopefully feel a little

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_00]: less shitty and a little less alone. Now if you are a suicide attempt survivor and you'd like to

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_00]: talk please reach out. Hello at SuicideNoted.com on Facebook or X at Suicide Noted. I want to

[00:01:23] [SPEAKER_00]: apologize because as you may have noticed today's episode was a little delayed. I won't

[00:01:29] [SPEAKER_00]: get into all the reasons why but I'm glad I'm able to get it out to you on Mondays

[00:01:33] [SPEAKER_00]: as I always try to do. Also we are having a members meeting in the next couple of weeks

[00:01:39] [SPEAKER_00]: and we will be discussing a topic or an idea or something important and those recordings at some

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_00]: point sooner than later will be special episodes. So if you want to be a part of that have that

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_00]: conversation and have your voice and your thoughts and your ideas aired out to the world.

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_00]: I encourage you to visit the link in the show notes where you can find information about

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_00]: that membership and all kinds of cool stuff. Finally we are talking about suicide on this

[00:02:05] [SPEAKER_00]: podcast and I don't hold back so please take that into account before you listen or as you

[00:02:10] [SPEAKER_00]: listen. But I do hope you listen because there is so much to learn. Today I am talking with Angela.

[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_00]: Angela lives in Ontario, Canada and she is a suicide attempt survivor. Hey Angela.

[00:02:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Hi. So you have been listening to some of the Suicide Noted podcasts yeah?

[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah I've been listening to them and I'm just wowed at it. Tell me how amazing I am please.

[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Well there's just not many people who even care to speak about it. It's literally that one fact

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_01]: you know you're willing to speak about it and that makes you amazing.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_01]: It needs to be looked at a lot harder than it is.

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_00]: How old or young are you Angela? I'm 47 years old.

[00:02:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Angela in her 40s in Ontario thank you for being here, thank you for talking with me.

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Appreciate it. Now your video is off I'm going to guess that you are why am I going to I think

[00:03:09] [SPEAKER_01]: you're in an act. No I'm out in my truck in the driveway. Another now this wasn't intended,

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_00]: it wasn't the plan but we do have another guest in a car or truck.

[00:03:21] [SPEAKER_01]: You know I thought should I go into town and sit in the parking lot of the Tim Hortons

[00:03:29] [SPEAKER_01]: and make sure I'm you know and I thought no I don't want to be sitting there talking you know

[00:03:35] [SPEAKER_01]: it's not the environment I want to be in but it's okay I'm still in

[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_01]: grass and trees and loveliness so I'm good.

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_00]: I know how you found this in me but I'm wondering why it is that at some point I'm

[00:03:49] [SPEAKER_00]: imagining in the past few months you were nosing around online or on a podcast platform

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure you put the word suicide in there so tell me about that please.

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Well it wasn't suicide but I was looking up the effects of loneliness in your TED talk

[00:04:07] [SPEAKER_01]: immediately underneath the video was the words in the little picture saying suicide noted

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_01]: and then underneath saying suicide attempted survive and I went what and I didn't listen to

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_01]: the TED talk I immediately tapped on that and I was like this is almost unbelievable is this

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_01]: like right away I was like what that's a very clever title also I was like this is nice you

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_01]: know like it's the acknowledgement of it in public right there on YouTube it's like whoa you

[00:04:39] [SPEAKER_01]: know it's hard to find other human beings who will even just say yeah oh wow I attempted

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_01]: too and this is what's happening with me and have just conversation.

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_00]: Angela you know I have a gift for memoir titles right you can't be that surprised that the title

[00:04:54] [SPEAKER_00]: of my podcast is decent too I mean simple and brilliant simple and brilliant love it hey how

[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_00]: did you find me with this podcast?

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I found this number one suicide noted episode and it was just a screen and talking and I'm

[00:05:10] [SPEAKER_01]: like oh I don't know if I can do this and I was just hooked yeah immediately I was like

[00:05:15] [SPEAKER_01]: wait a minute this isn't anything that I even thought it could be like it this is this is

[00:05:20] [SPEAKER_01]: this guy knows how to just let someone tell their story like wow I've been in all different

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_01]: places when it comes to it and I need to I need to share my story okay so I better

[00:05:33] [SPEAKER_01]: reach out to this guy and say man hey we got we gotta do this.

[00:05:37] [SPEAKER_00]: And despite the wi-fi issues we're making it happen are you wearing your seatbelt?

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_01]: No no way man.

[00:05:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Buckle up Angela because we're just getting pulling here you might want to put it on

[00:05:47] [SPEAKER_00]: because this baby's gonna get real real good.

[00:05:51] [SPEAKER_00]: I've never said that before all right so you uh let's just dive right in Angela let's not

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_00]: fuck around here how many suicide attempts do you have?

[00:05:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I have one suicide attempt myself somewhere around end of 2001 to early 2002 somewhere

[00:06:05] [SPEAKER_01]: in there.

[00:06:06] [SPEAKER_00]: So literally half your life ago almost.

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Leading up to that moment in which you attempted to take your life or from that moment when you

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_00]: attempted to take your life right so we're covering decades did you or do you regularly

[00:06:20] [SPEAKER_00]: think about ending your life?

[00:06:23] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah between the ages of 13 and 44 42 at least I thought about it continuously it was

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_01]: always in my subconscious mind it was never gone and there would be very creative ways

[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_01]: of thinking to kill myself ridiculous in fact.

[00:06:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Very creative and ridiculous probably is in the standard or common ways right so would

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_00]: you share one or two do you recall because I'm weird.

[00:06:52] [SPEAKER_01]: What can I do with this paperclip right now to end my life swiftly and possibly

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_01]: without too much pain is there something I could do is there somewhere in my eyeball I

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_01]: could stick it my brain would continually be working on I need to kill myself now as a

[00:07:08] [SPEAKER_01]: background program running while I was doing my day.

[00:07:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Okay so up until 13 not so much and then the last I guess few years not so much or

[00:07:18] [SPEAKER_00]: not as often.

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Correct everything has changed for the last few years I'm going to say that I'm lucky

[00:07:24] [SPEAKER_01]: to have experienced direct reasons that I can look back on to know exactly why I wanted

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_01]: to kill myself.

[00:07:33] [SPEAKER_00]: So if I ask you the question and I probably will like what led you to try to end your

[00:07:38] [SPEAKER_00]: life you would be have an answer.

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Can I speak about homicidal thoughts I had a specific incident happen where my own

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_01]: attempted to strangle me to death because of that incident and our family policy to

[00:07:56] [SPEAKER_01]: not speak about anything in our home and the bruises that were left had me go to

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_01]: school the next day and speak to counselors about it they brought in the police they

[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_01]: brought in the family and children services of the area they interviewed me they interviewed

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_01]: my father and then they kindly came and told me I was going to go home in my mother's

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_01]: car but to the family home and I stated there was no way I was going home.

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_01]: I begged them this was at 13 years of age to not let me go home he was going to kill me

[00:08:38] [SPEAKER_01]: and I was certain of it that's a pretty direct understanding of like in hindsight I

[00:08:45] [SPEAKER_01]: understand why after that point I had some issues when it came to you know they call

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_01]: them father issues but yeah so what happened after that was I had to go home with my

[00:08:56] [SPEAKER_01]: parent and I was assured by the police and family and children services that nothing

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_01]: bad would happen to me that it was an incident that was not going to occur again

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_01]: and he would never touch me at all ever again and I was not convinced of that.

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_01]: That's where I would say I did experience it was hard to deal with until I understood it

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_01]: but in hindsight I realized that I felt I needed to take his life so what I did was for the next

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_01]: seven nights in a row I don't know if you know a steak the steak knives with the plastic

[00:09:31] [SPEAKER_01]: handles I had one of those in my hand and I would creep into my parents room and stand

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_01]: there over my father and think can I stab him can I cut him somewhere he bleeds enough

[00:09:43] [SPEAKER_01]: that he can die quickly enough that no one really has to suffer too bad but that he's gone.

[00:09:49] [SPEAKER_00]: Angela I told now I want to let everyone else who's listening to this y'all need to put on

[00:09:54] [SPEAKER_00]: your seat belts I hate that you had to go through that but I love the honesty you want

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_00]: to talk about things people don't talk about Angela they don't talk about suicide they

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_00]: certainly don't talk about homicidal thoughts not often you wanting to literally kill your

[00:10:06] [SPEAKER_00]: father so seven straight days with a knife so you so I have this image where you're actually

[00:10:11] [SPEAKER_00]: you are actually in the room while they sleep and you're kind of like what going through

[00:10:17] [SPEAKER_01]: the motions thinking just where when how I'm standing there absolutely motionless trying to

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_01]: gather the will to do it I'm telling myself your sister is going to be safe your brother

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_01]: is going to be safe your mother is going to be safe if you get rid of this threat my

[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_01]: is going continuously that threat must be eliminated right because it was such a trauma

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_01]: what had happened the night before so the only thing that kept me from attempting to do anything

[00:10:46] [SPEAKER_01]: to him with that serrated little steak knife was the fact that my mother was laying right

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_01]: there and I did not want her to experience anything bad I just didn't want her experience

[00:10:58] [SPEAKER_01]: and I thought all I could think of his butt if I do it he's going to be experiencing

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_01]: something bad I don't want her to experience something bad they're both alive yes um after

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_01]: that the next year was absolute hell in our household if it was hell before it was some

[00:11:15] [SPEAKER_01]: sub layer of hell now what I didn't understand was I didn't understand how bad certain mental

[00:11:22] [SPEAKER_01]: illnesses can be and how there's no help for certain people with certain mental illnesses

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_01]: so when you have a father like mine who you believe is a normal everyday human being but

[00:11:35] [SPEAKER_01]: can have fits of rage and other things I mean there's so many other issues that happen that

[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know how to explain them what I came to understand later he must have been

[00:11:47] [SPEAKER_01]: suffering from psychopathy and or narcissistic personality disorder or some other thing including

[00:11:55] [SPEAKER_01]: both of those things but there's no way to know any of those things when you're a child

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_01]: or when someone's really putting on the show to the whole world of a saint no one believed my

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_01]: story also thinking I couldn't kill him and he was going to kill me and having a horrible

[00:12:15] [SPEAKER_01]: home life then my mother decided he was going to leave there were attempts by him to be

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_01]: a normal person I don't even know how to explain it he kept changing himself and saying is this

[00:12:28] [SPEAKER_01]: better is this better is this better and every time it was bad it was just really bad and

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_01]: it was like we don't know what you're trying to do but we don't want to be a part of it

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_01]: anymore was kind of the deal he just pointed it all my direction it was your fault for for

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_01]: telling everything's your fault for telling and that's great so my parents ultimately split

[00:12:51] [SPEAKER_01]: and my younger brother who was eight or nine at the time was left with my father my father said

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_01]: you you're not going with her you're staying with me and the girls are going with the mother

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_01]: and that's the way it's supposed to be so we left with our mother my me and my sister and

[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_01]: my brother stayed with my father my mother changed after that because little did we know

[00:13:13] [SPEAKER_01]: she had been fighting for custody of my brother and not getting anywhere and she started

[00:13:19] [SPEAKER_01]: having an alcohol issue for a little bit but she was still functional but he was a different

[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_01]: mother then when my brother did finally come to visit we could see there he was not the same

[00:13:29] [SPEAKER_01]: person and as a very young boy I think he was about almost 10 at that point we finally got a

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: visitation and he came into the middle of the living room sat down cross-legged and said you

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_01]: are all whores you've been spreading your legs to all the men in southern Ontario and I'm not

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_01]: moving or saying anything more till my dad comes and gets me and my mother ran off my sister

[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_01]: ran off she was like I don't know 11 12 tops I mean she didn't even understand what he was

[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_01]: saying literally he got up and walked out the door and my father was still down the road and

[00:14:10] [SPEAKER_00]: your father was obviously telling this to your brother and your brother at 10 years old is just

[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_00]: regurgitating that information back to you that you are quote-unquote whores yeah at what age does

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_00]: your brother take his own life 31 about 20 years after that he did really become an amazing

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_01]: human being for what he went through I mean to be able he actually held himself together

[00:14:35] [SPEAKER_01]: way better than you could imagine as a teenager and as a young man in his 20s I would have never

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_01]: believed some of the things he ended up telling me about what he experienced with my father

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_01]: afterward I was shocked I was like just really really shocked at how well he presented himself

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_01]: with the amount of abuse because then he was dealing also with the abandonment of my mother

[00:15:01] [SPEAKER_01]: right just as a as what has happened like there was no way to round that yeah he would have had

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_01]: abandonment issues as well as the trauma issues from my father right at 13 you start to think

[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_00]: this way because that's the age you said it started and it's not another for another 10 plus

[00:15:20] [SPEAKER_01]: years that you try I realize I'm not I need to maybe move out of the house myself I need to

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_01]: something I end up running away and going to a girlfriend's house for a couple weeks but

[00:15:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Christmas is coming and they say listen you just can't be here you got to go back home

[00:15:37] [SPEAKER_01]: and I end up back home and that's when my mother leaves I get through high school pretty

[00:15:43] [SPEAKER_01]: quickly I don't want to be there and I end up getting a full-time job at 17 and a half

[00:15:49] [SPEAKER_01]: and I have a boyfriend and that's great as long as I could keep the program of living

[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_01]: the make your money do your job as long as I can keep that up and I just don't act on all of the

[00:16:04] [SPEAKER_01]: ways I want to kill myself I figure I'm golden I'm golden forever but I didn't realize that

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_01]: I was slowly becoming an alcoholic there was the underlying the underlying self-hatred that

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_01]: that stayed right so not only did no one want to listen to me did no one believe that he tried

[00:16:25] [SPEAKER_01]: to take my life even though the reason why the counselor was there because the bruises

[00:16:29] [SPEAKER_01]: were there like the evidence was there but no one wanted to listen to it or wanted to do

[00:16:32] [SPEAKER_01]: anything about it in my eyes and I couldn't eliminate the threat so it was a state of

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_01]: constant fear when before with my father would put me in duressful states it was it was always

[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_01]: about your grades and he had a rubber a rubber mallet that he had written my name on in

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_01]: white out because the mallet is black and he would bring it to the kitchen table when

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_01]: the report card came and he said every bad grade you're going to get a knock in the

[00:16:58] [SPEAKER_01]: head with the rubber mallet and every time there was a test date they remember the rubber

[00:17:02] [SPEAKER_01]: mallet unfortunately when you're stuck in duress when you're fearful of the grade you're

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_01]: really can't concentrate on a test so I was pretty poor in school and I was just continually

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_01]: told I was going to get hit with the mallet but never got hit with the mallet but the fear was

[00:17:17] [SPEAKER_01]: enough to traumatize me as a young child right yeah so then I move out I have my own place

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_01]: I get married and I continue on with this world of you know do these steps and this is what

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_01]: is I did all the steps I tried a million and one jobs you know I tried to fill that hole

[00:17:37] [SPEAKER_01]: that void hole of pain with everything I could anything I could now not alcohol and cigarettes

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_01]: but I never really touched anything else except for marijuana when I was 25 at some point in

[00:17:52] [SPEAKER_00]: time frame your daily ideations go to the next level so to speak and you try so what is I mean

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_00]: let's just go to that day in as much as you can recall like what was there something different

[00:18:07] [SPEAKER_00]: about that day or was it more of just a piling up and that's when things just broke

[00:18:13] [SPEAKER_01]: it was exactly that 100% I have I have tried every type of relationship with a man I have

[00:18:21] [SPEAKER_01]: tried every type of job out there that I want to do that I think I can do I have tried

[00:18:28] [SPEAKER_01]: everything that our world that I thought said I could try to do and I'm just I'm not happy

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to be here what's the point of this why am I in so much internal agony

[00:18:44] [SPEAKER_01]: and I have no answers and there's no one to help I had just been through a breakup

[00:18:50] [SPEAKER_01]: so there was definitely the abandonment issue because that all I was thinking was okay that's

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_01]: the last one and there's not going to be any more guys I was like literally saying that's it

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm abandoning myself from relationships like I'm just done and then I just realized you know

[00:19:08] [SPEAKER_01]: what I don't have any more energy to keep doing this to figure out what's going to be

[00:19:12] [SPEAKER_01]: next like I just keep hoping for something and it's not there where where is it what is it

[00:19:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what it is and I something just said well you've lost your will

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_01]: and I just was like yeah I've lost my will to live right isn't that arguably I don't want

[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_00]: to simplify any of this but that's kind of what just about every guest has in common here

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I was just like like what happens before you attempt to take your life

[00:19:38] [SPEAKER_00]: you have probably lost your will to live they just have to go hand in hand I think

[00:19:45] [SPEAKER_00]: there might be people certainly who want to live but perhaps circumstantially there's no way out

[00:19:52] [SPEAKER_00]: but it's still you can maybe it's semantics but all right so what do you do that day I wrote my

[00:19:59] [SPEAKER_01]: note I wrote my note to my brother because he lived with me at the time and I wrote the note

[00:20:05] [SPEAKER_01]: saying I'm sorry I've lost my will to live I'm done maybe a couple of lines saying sorry

[00:20:12] [SPEAKER_01]: him you know that I was going but I just I don't have any more left in me basic I've lost my will

[00:20:18] [SPEAKER_01]: I think I've lost my will to live and I gathered my pills that I thought would gently

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_01]: ease me to sleep and off to death and never to see this world again and I really believed

[00:20:30] [SPEAKER_01]: that and I laid down on my couch after swallowing them and I said this is it it's good

[00:20:37] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't have to deal with any more pain do you remember what you were thinking if anything else

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_00]: in those moments it's gonna be over relief slash anticipation it almost sounds like yes

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_01]: I did not want to struggle anymore I my body started literally burning from the inside out my

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_01]: bones felt like they were on fire everything started hurting in a way I have never experienced

[00:21:03] [SPEAKER_01]: before and I grit through it for a bit I clenched my fists and I said no that's fine

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_01]: and I said I've seen enough torture movies this pain is gonna knock me out too fine that's fine

[00:21:17] [SPEAKER_01]: if this is it then that's fine and I try and I tried and it seemed like forever but it must

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: not have been that long until I was wide awake and running around in screaming pain unable to

[00:21:30] [SPEAKER_01]: what to do next and I picked up the phone and dialed 911 they I was in a big town they were

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_01]: there in moments it was not long I by the time I could unlock the door and the operator was

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_01]: saying stay on the line I was passing out in front of a paramedic I was still thinking good

[00:21:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm dying they can't revive me they still got to get me they got to get me somewhere

[00:21:56] [SPEAKER_01]: dying in my in my doorway right here oh beautiful you know at least I'll already be at the hospital

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_01]: in the wagon my brother won't have to find my body and off I went but I woke up spoiler

[00:22:09] [SPEAKER_00]: every single person I talked to and we know it didn't work no it did not I was so naive

[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean wow I really did think you know I mean it was it was 150 199 gonna work like

[00:22:24] [SPEAKER_01]: it's just no way it wouldn't yeah no I woke up and I basically just said you know first I

[00:22:30] [SPEAKER_01]: they had the catheter in they had to pull out you know only once I was awake the charcoal

[00:22:35] [SPEAKER_01]: drink still in the mouth and whatnot and um and the psychiatrist at the bedside and

[00:22:41] [SPEAKER_01]: they basically just said we got someone here to come pick you up what happened and I said oh

[00:22:47] [SPEAKER_01]: man I just had a breakup and I was just feeling really lonely for a moment I just

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_01]: some pills I'm so sorry man like I feel I feel horrible meanwhile I'm saying god

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_01]: damn why did I wake up why am I here I don't want to I don't want to tell this guy this

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_00]: and get him off my back right so so you could have said or one could have said like

[00:23:10] [SPEAKER_00]: I am really doing bad I did not want to live I don't think I want to live why didn't you

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I had dealt with so much so many other people not listening to me not caring exposing

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_01]: myself to them and what was going on and them not having any answers or help for me

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_00]: might say like why keep being so open and honest right sure I assumed immediately that

[00:23:37] [SPEAKER_01]: with what I had already experienced with the health community and everything even just in the

[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_01]: public school um was that no one's gonna have any help for you they're gonna listen to what

[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_01]: you say they're gonna like write it down somewhere but they're not actually gonna have

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_01]: any help for you you're still stuck in the same position so just keep your mouth shut until

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_01]: you figure something else out until you can figure it out there's no one else that's

[00:24:05] [SPEAKER_01]: gonna figure it out for you because they obviously don't know or they would uh they

[00:24:09] [SPEAKER_01]: have help yeah the way I looked at it was if this psychiatrist actually had help and he's any and

[00:24:15] [SPEAKER_01]: a guy was telling them on the on the 911 call that I was trying to kill myself like uh you know

[00:24:21] [SPEAKER_01]: if this psychiatrist had some type of help when he's sitting there at my bedside he'd be

[00:24:25] [SPEAKER_01]: offering it he wouldn't be asking me why he wouldn't be he'd be saying hey you tried to

[00:24:30] [SPEAKER_01]: kill yourself we have this help for you here it is not oh okay yeah you can slap it out

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_01]: oh no it was just it was just it was just this thing you know there's just something that

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_01]: happened well you know if it's just something that happens to people out of nowhere you know how

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_00]: can it ever be helped you were put in a position to try to figure it out by yourself and from

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_00]: what you shared earlier you did kind of figure it out it just took you about 20 more years

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah well it took other situations like my brother's suicide I don't know I put me into

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_01]: like full force and then stop type of motion uh it was like okay he successfully killed himself

[00:25:07] [SPEAKER_01]: I can successfully kill myself I had hope again so after the first attempt I had no hope that I

[00:25:13] [SPEAKER_01]: could kill myself I wasn't even going to try but that's when the funny thoughts of how could

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I in in hopes that possibly through all of that overstimulated thought and overthinking

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_01]: I could come up with a way to die maybe there'd be this way for sure no doubt I was gonna go

[00:25:34] [SPEAKER_01]: and uh it gave me time you didn't try but I didn't want to know there was no way I was going

[00:25:42] [SPEAKER_01]: to try again but that made that put me in a much worse psychological state it caused me to

[00:25:49] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah really bad depression and a lot of hateful feelings a lot of anger and hate that I couldn't

[00:25:58] [SPEAKER_01]: reconcile with it was very difficult because you point out others and then you point at

[00:26:03] [SPEAKER_01]: yourselves and then you point out others and then you point out yourself and then you're just

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_01]: stuck in that it's like almost a fight within yourself you don't know what to do and you

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_01]: don't think there's anyone who can help you because you feel 100 alone and even though

[00:26:16] [SPEAKER_01]: you're surrounded by a bunch of people all people who say they love you and you're like no man

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_00]: it's just not there I know that you had a challenging and I'm using my own words you're

[00:26:25] [SPEAKER_00]: like rather challenging upbringing try in your 20s your brother passes away from suicide in your

[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_01]: and his 30s and in your 40s something changes what happens is I'm I'm bouncing between I have

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_01]: to kill myself and I can because once my brother committed suicide so I'm dealing with grief

[00:26:49] [SPEAKER_01]: right I'm dealing with with his loss and I know everything he went through and I and I

[00:26:56] [SPEAKER_01]: realize it is this past of abuse that caused it and I need to expose this if I stay living

[00:27:03] [SPEAKER_01]: so I've got these two opposites yes you can kill yourself go and just do it get it over

[00:27:08] [SPEAKER_01]: with and done or expose this continue to speak up about why no one's helping anyone who

[00:27:16] [SPEAKER_01]: who thinks they're actually living with a narcissist have a parent who is a narcissist

[00:27:21] [SPEAKER_01]: and or a psychopath people who are doing weird and strange things in the household that

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_01]: might not be considered abuse offhand but are not good and and it can really really hurt

[00:27:34] [SPEAKER_01]: the child's mental state I try and get involved in personal situations like this and help

[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_01]: people who can see this and aren't getting any help there's a lot of it there's a lot

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_01]: of children in homes with parents who are not properly taking care of those children and

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_01]: are put through all of the system's paces and nothing has happened the children still

[00:28:01] [SPEAKER_01]: suffer the exact same consequences they would have either way I want to better understand

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_00]: how you got from thinking about ending your life regularly to not as soon as I started

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_01]: piecing together that and seeing that no one else was really going there no one else wants

[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_01]: to go there and especially as psychologists and psychiatrists I started contacting many of them

[00:28:27] [SPEAKER_01]: after my brother passed and said listen this is what's going on I need your help I want help

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't particularly want to die I would rather expose this but I'm not getting any help like

[00:28:37] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to have to go and learn psychology like I don't I don't want to you know go for

[00:28:43] [SPEAKER_01]: 15 more years worth of schooling to know what you do can I just find someone who can help me

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER_01]: that has letters behind their name so other people listen to them and I got nowhere and

[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_01]: that really put me down I was like what do you mean there's these people out there who

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_01]: can really seriously hurt children and they get away with it still to this day there's no help

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_01]: for them or the children or the people who are with those people unless those people who have

[00:29:11] [SPEAKER_01]: this problem come to you and say I'm a psychopath or I think I have a problem can you diagnose

[00:29:18] [SPEAKER_01]: me and their diagnosis includes the fact that they will never go to anyone and ask for help

[00:29:23] [SPEAKER_01]: because they don't think they need it uh-oh at that point I decided I'm killing myself this is

[00:29:30] [SPEAKER_01]: too much I can't wrap my head around this I'm done I'm going to do what my brother did I'm

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_01]: gonna do exactly what my brother did and I'm going to explain why because there is no help

[00:29:42] [SPEAKER_01]: there's just no help when everyone says they're helping it'd be fine if they said I can't help

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_01]: you okay then we're getting somewhere but when they say I can help you and they can't so I

[00:29:53] [SPEAKER_01]: said to myself I'm gonna go online for the rest of the day I'm gonna give myself 24 hours

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_01]: of searching online for information that's gonna keep me wanting to be here and I found it within

[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_01]: about three hours I don't know why or how but I found the information about the victim abuse

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_01]: cycle I found information about what thoughts emotions and actions are like just knowing oh

[00:30:20] [SPEAKER_01]: a thought is something going on in my head I can somehow control that when someone on the internet

[00:30:26] [SPEAKER_01]: said that you can control your thought it blew my mind I was like what do you mean I can control

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_01]: that I can control that somehow wait a minute this doesn't make sense and it took it took a

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_01]: long time but that spark of I can figure this out and say it was actually about 29 it was

[00:30:46] [SPEAKER_01]: little over a year maybe 40 when I made that decision that day I'd been struggling back and

[00:30:53] [SPEAKER_01]: forth so hard and I made the decision that's it you're killing yourself if you don't find

[00:30:58] [SPEAKER_01]: the information and then it seems like the information has continued to come so I believe

[00:31:03] [SPEAKER_01]: now in cause and effect I feel that that's exactly what's going on it's like the

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_01]: mechanism of cause and effect is continuously feeding me the information I need to keep going

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_01]: so that I never ever once have to think about not being here I wouldn't even know where to begin

[00:31:22] [SPEAKER_01]: I can call it some sort of divinity but I have to say the only thing I know is I have a life

[00:31:29] [SPEAKER_01]: force inside me when I'm dead that life force is gone and whatever is in that life force

[00:31:35] [SPEAKER_01]: it's what's helping me okay I've tried to look into religions I've tried to look into

[00:31:42] [SPEAKER_01]: all sorts of sciences and it's just like you know what all I need to know is that I'm alive

[00:31:46] [SPEAKER_01]: all I need to know is that I think I have emotions about my thoughts and I can take actions

[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I've bare minimumed it I went down to the basics because I realized the life that I grew up

[00:31:56] [SPEAKER_01]: in was nothing that was stable there was no foundation there and that's why I had that

[00:32:02] [SPEAKER_01]: massive hole of pain there was nothing there I had nothing to hold on to I was in a hole

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_01]: with no rope to climb out there was just nothing there and I start going through all of my childhood

[00:32:18] [SPEAKER_01]: experiences and realizing ah okay I feel might feel this way because of that and I might feel

[00:32:23] [SPEAKER_01]: this way because of that so I don't need to feel those things I don't need to think those

[00:32:26] [SPEAKER_01]: things I don't need to have any of those types of thoughts anymore but recently you put in

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_00]: loneliness somewhere to find something and eventually found this podcast yeah when I

[00:32:37] [SPEAKER_01]: was with partners who were narcissistic and with my father who is narcissistic there is a I don't

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER_01]: know what it's like a worse loneliness than loneliness um when you are free of those people

[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_01]: being around you you aren't lonely anymore even if you are alone well you aren't no I wasn't

[00:32:57] [SPEAKER_01]: anyways I that's what I experienced I experienced that this aching loneliness that I was feeling

[00:33:04] [SPEAKER_01]: something to do with having many of these people in my life and feeling um because there's a lot of

[00:33:13] [SPEAKER_01]: devaluation right um that comes from those people and then if you already feel low about

[00:33:18] [SPEAKER_01]: yourself you sometimes only have to be around them to feel it especially if you you have

[00:33:24] [SPEAKER_01]: some empathetic all of a sudden you you think you're alone and you don't understand why this

[00:33:30] [SPEAKER_01]: is making loneliness but some of it lifts when you remove some of these people from your day

[00:33:35] [SPEAKER_00]: to day um if you can I mean if you can if you can loneliness is such an interesting

[00:33:41] [SPEAKER_00]: and I think often really misunderstood idea or experience so as we speak right now you don't

[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_00]: want to end your life correct you are lonely no you're not lonely okay I was going to say

[00:33:55] [SPEAKER_00]: good but I tend to hesitate to say anything like that good or bad right just it is what it

[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_00]: okay I have a few questions that may seem unrelated but they're sort of a bit of a

[00:34:04] [SPEAKER_00]: pachinko bouncing around thing okay here we go how many people know that we're talking

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_01]: quite a few everyone I've personally spoke to that I have a personal connection with in the

[00:34:16] [SPEAKER_01]: last couple weeks since I sent you the email I've said hey you know about this podcast

[00:34:21] [SPEAKER_01]: whether or not any of them are even interested in listening to it or anything else that's their

[00:34:27] [SPEAKER_01]: deal when I find something new and I speak to people that's how I kind of even judge you know

[00:34:33] [SPEAKER_01]: is this person going to be a closer friend or are they going to pull away did you keep the no

[00:34:37] [SPEAKER_01]: it wasn't there when I got home oh okay somebody got rid of it yeah that would have been my

[00:34:44] [SPEAKER_01]: brother yeah and he came and picked me up from the hospital he figured out over time that

[00:34:50] [SPEAKER_00]: some of the stuff your father was telling him was not true yes in hindsight just to see how

[00:34:56] [SPEAKER_01]: he even went to my mother later and said you know I held grudge against you for a long time

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_01]: because I thought this and I thought that and I thought this about you but I totally forgive

[00:35:05] [SPEAKER_01]: you for anything that you might have done and you know I love you and whatnot and there was

[00:35:10] [SPEAKER_01]: they had an exchange where they were reunited as an adult or well a young man he reconciled

[00:35:18] [SPEAKER_01]: with with mom and they and they became whatever an adult son and mother would be

[00:35:24] [SPEAKER_00]: without that middle part I bet your mom liked that day when he finally was able to reconnect

[00:35:30] [SPEAKER_01]: with her well yeah he has two uh children and and a widow and um my mother is a big part of

[00:35:39] [SPEAKER_01]: their lives so she's you know she has that which is really really good have you ever

[00:35:54] [SPEAKER_01]: physically couldn't stop crying for me I have no medical leave from my job I literally could not

[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_01]: understand why I was physically crying and not feeling sad at all of course I still was

[00:36:08] [SPEAKER_01]: ideating behind it all but feeling sad no I'm going through my emotions I'm going through

[00:36:13] [SPEAKER_01]: my day there isn't something happening that I should be sad about is what my logic mind was

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_01]: or what I was saying to myself I went to my doctor they set me up with a psychiatrist

[00:36:23] [SPEAKER_01]: and I started telling the incidents to the psychiatrist and I went on a lot of medications

[00:36:28] [SPEAKER_01]: and I had a lot of diagnoses so it was first an acute depression and anxiety even though I

[00:36:36] [SPEAKER_01]: told him I felt fine I just couldn't stop crying and then after telling my story and

[00:36:42] [SPEAKER_01]: starting on the first uh antidepressant drugs uh there was just you know oh okay so you have

[00:36:48] [SPEAKER_01]: PTSD all right and oh okay so you have schizoaffective disorder well it makes sense that

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_01]: you wouldn't trust people if you couldn't trust them yeah I guess so okay so yeah so this is a

[00:36:59] [SPEAKER_01]: normal thing these are all normal reactions to the life you've had so here's a whole bunch of

[00:37:04] [SPEAKER_01]: chemicals to fix that for you you're gonna be all right head on home you know you'll be

[00:37:09] [SPEAKER_01]: back to work in no time meanwhile I have the employment insurance telling me you're on medical

[00:37:15] [SPEAKER_01]: and you can get a job you need to get a job you have to get a job right now and I'm like no no

[00:37:20] [SPEAKER_01]: no I'm still having issues I'm testing out all these medicines on myself and they're not doing

[00:37:26] [SPEAKER_01]: good I'm feeling really bad and feeling way worse than I could have felt to be crying all

[00:37:33] [SPEAKER_01]: that much but I wasn't feeling bad when I was crying so now I'm feeling really bad and everyone

[00:37:37] [SPEAKER_01]: says oh you look so much better so I'm not liking this come the third pill I think it was

[00:37:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I ended up taking I started gaining weight so quickly I couldn't carry myself anymore and that

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER_01]: was I think I gained 30 pounds in 20 days and I called up the psychiatrist and I said I'm not

[00:37:57] [SPEAKER_01]: taking this anymore there's an issue oh you got to give it a couple months I said there's

[00:38:01] [SPEAKER_01]: no way there's no way I'm giving this a couple months so I stopped that one immediately

[00:38:06] [SPEAKER_01]: but unfortunately I still was on this regiment of pills that I did not like and they were

[00:38:11] [SPEAKER_01]: telling me you got you got to keep on them you can't just start something and stop them

[00:38:14] [SPEAKER_01]: so I tried that after about three years of trying and going up and up and up on doses

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_01]: of all of these medicines I was done and I said that's enough I'm going to I'm going

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_01]: to leave the city I'm just going to say I don't I don't want to do this anymore

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_01]: and I'm going to leave the city and I got in my minivan with my boyfriend and my two dogs

[00:38:35] [SPEAKER_01]: my cat and we moved all the way up north here in northern Ontario we lived out of the van

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_01]: in the winter time I don't know a month or two until we found an apartment which there weren't

[00:38:49] [SPEAKER_01]: many of in the little northern town we were hanging out around started to try and take

[00:38:54] [SPEAKER_01]: myself off of antidepressants and antipsychotics and it was not fun did you get

[00:39:03] [SPEAKER_01]: PTSD and I'm sure you know this gets so effective portion of the understanding that yeah you don't

[00:39:11] [SPEAKER_01]: trust people because when I put my trust in them there was nothing back it makes sense to me then

[00:39:17] [SPEAKER_01]: is that a mental condition or is that a condition of what I went like I mean right

[00:39:22] [SPEAKER_01]: so if I went through that and you're telling me that this is a mental illness this is this

[00:39:28] [SPEAKER_01]: measure up that means that society and how we run and what goes on in it is causing in part

[00:39:35] [SPEAKER_01]: the human beings to be ill totally how can I rectify this if it's partially uh our societal

[00:39:45] [SPEAKER_00]: structure what one thing you might try is to get into a van and go to northern Ontario

[00:39:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I ended up finding an amazing doctor uh he was a GP I came to him oh gee 2008 I think you may have

[00:40:01] [SPEAKER_01]: heard of him maybe not he was called the pot doctor up here um he tried taking people off

[00:40:06] [SPEAKER_01]: of opiates and putting them on weed or marijuana medical marijuana sorry he he was the only person

[00:40:12] [SPEAKER_01]: you know up here that had a doctor's office that was actually taking a patient that would

[00:40:18] [SPEAKER_01]: someone had said it somewhere and I decided to walk into his office and I said listen

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_01]: I haven't seen a doctor in a couple years I'm still getting these prescriptions for these

[00:40:28] [SPEAKER_01]: things I don't think I need these chemicals I just want to understand what's going on and

[00:40:34] [SPEAKER_01]: I want to help my own self out I've been trying to take myself off of these and his

[00:40:38] [SPEAKER_01]: face just dropped I said I need your help I'll be your patient if you'll just take me off

[00:40:45] [SPEAKER_01]: these and not do any more doctor stuff with me just help wean me off these pills will you do this

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_01]: for me and he said of course I will and I went thank you that was it I mean he helped a lot

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_01]: because I told him I said you know sometimes I kind of feel suicidal he's like oh no right

[00:41:03] [SPEAKER_01]: now and you know he did all the you know do we need to take you somewhere whatever you know

[00:41:07] [SPEAKER_01]: and it said not now no but every once in a while you know I feel it and I was testing

[00:41:13] [SPEAKER_01]: him out right he told me said well listen anytime you need to there's a key hidden

[00:41:18] [SPEAKER_01]: right over here let me show you and he brought me up to it he said this key right here opens

[00:41:23] [SPEAKER_01]: this door over here let me show you and if you ever need to come here you just come here instead

[00:41:29] [SPEAKER_01]: nice whether I'm home whether I'm not whether my wife's here whether she no it doesn't

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_01]: matter you just come here instead and that was it that was oh my gosh there could be

[00:41:41] [SPEAKER_01]: a

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_01]: right because then all of a sudden you know one out of every 10 thoughts was not I can

[00:41:50] [SPEAKER_00]: kill myself but I can go there so you found this person and it was sounds like it was a huge

[00:41:54] [SPEAKER_00]: huge deal yeah you get off the meds yes for some reason I feel like the relationship with

[00:42:00] [SPEAKER_00]: the guy doesn't work out but I could be wrong no no for sure not until you started feeling

[00:42:06] [SPEAKER_00]: and speaking more openly about your experiences did you keep mostly keep your attempt that

[00:42:14] [SPEAKER_01]: overdose kind of a secret 100% I would never lie but I would never tell anybody it I skirted

[00:42:23] [SPEAKER_01]: around every attempt of anyone to even mention it there was no way I was letting anyone know

[00:42:30] [SPEAKER_01]: for whoever might have already known it was like a fear the same type of fear as beforehand

[00:42:37] [SPEAKER_01]: where I came close to death or that's what my psyche believed now I got to keep my mouth shut

[00:42:44] [SPEAKER_01]: this time I cannot open my mouth because that created more havoc than there ever could have

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_01]: been so I better just keep my mouth shut and you know I really I'm kind of glad I did because

[00:42:57] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think I have it in me to have gone to a hospital even a 72 hours day

[00:43:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know how I would have handled that I'm just so shocked at people who are who are able

[00:43:10] [SPEAKER_01]: to to go through that I said no to things a lot because it was so aggravating to me already

[00:43:19] [SPEAKER_01]: but if I was even just a little bit more easeful I would have I would have been through

[00:43:23] [SPEAKER_01]: I think I might have gone through a lot worse I refused to tell anybody that I had attempted

[00:43:28] [SPEAKER_01]: and even after my brother I never told people that I had attempted was there a period of time

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_00]: where you would think back to your attempt in which man I wish that had worked yes but it

[00:43:41] [SPEAKER_01]: always followed with I wish that I killed my father first do you feel that way now so when

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_01]: it comes to wishes right and we look back on our past I can only wish that there was help

[00:43:52] [SPEAKER_01]: for my father because I know once you understand abandonment and you understand neglect and you

[00:43:59] [SPEAKER_01]: understand you know how abuse work you want that solved you'd want what I would want

[00:44:05] [SPEAKER_01]: is to have you know my mother and my father in my family together and everyone loving and

[00:44:11] [SPEAKER_01]: like on all the tv shows that we love and adore now and if you say well you have the option of

[00:44:19] [SPEAKER_01]: now you go back in time you have the option the only option is you kill your father or you don't

[00:44:24] [SPEAKER_01]: and you have the chance again too and your brother possibly lives because he doesn't get

[00:44:30] [SPEAKER_01]: abused or whatever there'd have to be a real specific scenario it's just all in the

[00:44:35] [SPEAKER_01]: imagination when it comes to our past so because I now have understood and went into and taught

[00:44:43] [SPEAKER_01]: myself the best I can about these two conditions that are totally overlooked called psychopathy

[00:44:52] [SPEAKER_01]: and narcissistic personality disorder and try to understand these people's perspective that

[00:45:00] [SPEAKER_01]: they've shared the ones who are diagnosed and share their how it is they see the world

[00:45:07] [SPEAKER_01]: it is so understandable why I suffered what I did with my father it's just 100% laid out there

[00:45:16] [SPEAKER_01]: yet there's nothing in our society there's no way to do anything about it we don't have any

[00:45:23] [SPEAKER_01]: new to identify these people in our midst and say we want to help you the option is if you

[00:45:33] [SPEAKER_01]: think that they are like this just stay away from them get them out of your life abandon them

[00:45:38] [SPEAKER_01]: right and get them out of your life now you don't have to worry the consequences

[00:45:43] [SPEAKER_01]: of their actions and you just work on you they're off abusing other people then it's a

[00:45:52] [SPEAKER_00]: bring up possible ideations and they'd be okay with it I have two people who would be okay with

[00:45:59] [SPEAKER_01]: it I'd have lots of people that I would still talk to about it though okay even though

[00:46:04] [SPEAKER_01]: as I think about it many of them would wouldn't be too okay with it they'd sit

[00:46:09] [SPEAKER_01]: and they'd listen a little bit they'd probably offer a whole bunch of you know call this

[00:46:13] [SPEAKER_01]: number or can you do this or yeah no I didn't though that breakup left me absolute

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_01]: no vehicle half the income that I had and bedridden and I had a sick dog I wasn't too sure

[00:46:29] [SPEAKER_01]: what I was going to do because I didn't really have anyone that I was communicating with on a

[00:46:35] [SPEAKER_01]: regular basis and I was pretty sure that I might pass away before I got better because

[00:46:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I had some health issues I was able to find a service here for the elderly who will call

[00:46:48] [SPEAKER_01]: you every morning and literally make sure you're alive I contacted them and I said listen I don't

[00:46:54] [SPEAKER_01]: have anybody I'm worried that you know if I pass away and my animals are just stuck here

[00:47:00] [SPEAKER_01]: it's gonna be days and I I would like the service if you wouldn't mind and they said

[00:47:05] [SPEAKER_01]: oh yes that's not a problem uh this wonderful lady she's getting close to 80 years old

[00:47:13] [SPEAKER_01]: in the community and uh she calls me every morning like clockwork and has a brief pleasant

[00:47:21] [SPEAKER_01]: conversation we get along on every everything you could possibly imagine and some things we

[00:47:26] [SPEAKER_01]: don't but as I build you know a little bit of trust here and a little bit of trust there I did

[00:47:31] [SPEAKER_01]: have to reach out I had to reach out I had to start saying I need help here and is there

[00:47:36] [SPEAKER_01]: this help here and the little bits of help that I could get like that they mean everything

[00:47:41] [SPEAKER_01]: and now it's been a few years even if I have a bunch of people who she knows are in contact with

[00:47:46] [SPEAKER_01]: me enough that I'm okay she still calls me every morning she's like no I'll still call you're

[00:47:51] [SPEAKER_00]: still on my list nice okay so it's time to talk pink and purple pill if Angela takes it

[00:47:59] [SPEAKER_00]: would um put her to sleep quietly and peacefully and she would not wake up and there'd be no

[00:48:04] [SPEAKER_00]: pain and she would be gone and nobody would know that it was a suicide and so I give the

[00:48:10] [SPEAKER_00]: option to take it or save it or get rid of it but you have a different answer so tell me I would

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_01]: take that pill and I would take a picture of that pill and I would try to get as much exposure

[00:48:22] [SPEAKER_01]: and awareness of the pill as possible I would want every last human being in the world to

[00:48:28] [SPEAKER_01]: understand that there is such a thing called suicide in this world where human beings are

[00:48:34] [SPEAKER_01]: in so much pain that they want to take their own life and it is such a shameful act and such

[00:48:39] [SPEAKER_01]: this embarrassing thing such as horrible thing that no one wants to talk to anybody about except

[00:48:45] [SPEAKER_01]: for you and me I guess that this pill had to be concocted for people to feel okay to want to die

[00:48:55] [SPEAKER_01]: there's there are human beings out here who want to die so bad and they're willing to

[00:49:01] [SPEAKER_01]: take their own lives yeah and no one wants to talk about it no one wants to talk about the

[00:49:05] [SPEAKER_01]: reasons why no one wants to it's just shut right out and that there has to be this option

[00:49:12] [SPEAKER_01]: that I mean and what a beautiful op I mean I can take this pill and if I want to kill myself

[00:49:19] [SPEAKER_01]: no one's gonna know that it was suicide so everybody's conscience is clear right and

[00:49:25] [SPEAKER_01]: it's all okay it's just another death that happens like every other death in the world

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_01]: just we'll get through our steps our grieving steps and it'll be fine and it's not a suicide

[00:49:36] [SPEAKER_01]: right I would want awareness I would want I would want everyone to know hey there is such

[00:49:41] [SPEAKER_00]: a thing as this pink and purple pill you'd like to do it as a sacrifice almost a martyr

[00:49:46] [SPEAKER_01]: and it's because of the fact that no one wants to deal with this thing called suicide

[00:49:52] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I know well so few so few other specific myths or misconceptions you'd like to dispel

[00:49:59] [SPEAKER_01]: around any of this stuff yeah that suicide is stupid oh okay we can take stupid actions yeah I

[00:50:10] [SPEAKER_01]: was naive and therefore stupid to think that all those those pills I took would actually just

[00:50:15] [SPEAKER_01]: do what I thought they were gonna do but I'm not stupid and I've noticed by listening to

[00:50:21] [SPEAKER_01]: the podcasts that I have listened to and I haven't listened to all of them most of your

[00:50:29] [SPEAKER_01]: it's like wow maybe there's something to this maybe there's a reason why we do over process

[00:50:35] [SPEAKER_01]: in our in our minds right why we have the thoughts over processing on each other and

[00:50:40] [SPEAKER_01]: what's going on here with that I decided that I was going to utilize that too for good not

[00:50:46] [SPEAKER_01]: not to sit here and think about how how can I kill myself but think about how or why or any

[00:50:51] [SPEAKER_01]: of the other questions on any other thing in the world until I educate myself well enough to

[00:50:57] [SPEAKER_01]: help this situation because it's a big situation and it seems overwhelming but it seems like I've

[00:51:03] [SPEAKER_01]: already had all the overwhelming in my life I could ever have even if I can do you know

[00:51:07] [SPEAKER_01]: five more things in a second than someone else mentally right because it's just going

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_01]: going going maybe I can come up with a solution maybe I can work on it in my head instead of

[00:51:17] [SPEAKER_00]: working on how do I kill myself when you emailed me you sent me a link it was a

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_00]: different things you're doing so is there a way to somewhat succinctly share with me and the

[00:51:32] [SPEAKER_00]: audience what is this work you're involved with like what is it what's the goal kind of thing

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_01]: I decided what I already knew about the abuse cycle I needed to dumb it down I needed to get

[00:51:45] [SPEAKER_01]: it right down to basics I thought okay if I'm going to talk about suicide it's going to be

[00:51:49] [SPEAKER_01]: to adults and I'm going to need to have to talk to adults so I can you know discuss

[00:51:55] [SPEAKER_01]: the limbic system and I can discuss you know all these fancy wonderful things and but no

[00:52:00] [SPEAKER_01]: there's children who are being abused who might not understand it they might not get it

[00:52:07] [SPEAKER_01]: they might not understand that if someone else is is doing harm to them that they don't

[00:52:12] [SPEAKER_01]: they don't have to be on the victim side they can do something internally so what I

[00:52:18] [SPEAKER_01]: wrote there on my YouTube page so I only have two videos on my page one is the what you may

[00:52:24] [SPEAKER_01]: not know and that was my attempt at explaining the victim abuse cycle to possibly a child or a

[00:52:32] [SPEAKER_01]: teenager in hopes that they might be able to comprehend that someone who's abusing you was

[00:52:37] [SPEAKER_01]: abused and they condone the abuse even if it's not consciously it's subconsciously

[00:52:42] [SPEAKER_01]: somewhere in them they don't think that that's wrong and somewhere in you you think it's wrong

[00:52:47] [SPEAKER_01]: you're the one being hurt of course so there's a dynamic happening there and you don't you

[00:52:52] [SPEAKER_01]: have to live in that dynamic I wanted to try and see if there's a way to convey that and then

[00:52:59] [SPEAKER_01]: pull yourself out of the dynamic make sure you aren't harming other people and then do as much

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_01]: help as you can the more actions you take the better helpful the less time you got to do harm

[00:53:09] [SPEAKER_01]: do you think you'll make it to 50 yeah in fact the psychiatrics weren't the only medical

[00:53:15] [SPEAKER_01]: things I've endured what I found out was when you're suffering in a household with

[00:53:20] [SPEAKER_01]: narcissistic abuse happening you can have physiological issues and I was going to the

[00:53:27] [SPEAKER_01]: doctor from as young as I can remember all the way until I realized I had to take care of my

[00:53:34] [SPEAKER_01]: own health and in my mid-40s only a few years ago I stopped seeing doctors all together after

[00:53:40] [SPEAKER_01]: removing myself from the pharmaceutical meds for the psychiatric conditions I started having

[00:53:49] [SPEAKER_01]: thyroid issues I already wasn't seeing any doctors other than that GP I ended up having

[00:53:56] [SPEAKER_01]: to see many doctors for my thyroid issue and my pills again were going up and up and up and

[00:54:01] [SPEAKER_01]: dose and I was experiencing a gazillion other symptoms excruciating pain in many different

[00:54:10] [SPEAKER_01]: parts of my body there's so many times I thought oh my gosh I'm not sure if I'm going

[00:54:14] [SPEAKER_01]: the night with this pain that I can't pinpoint I'd rush down to the hospital they do x-rays and

[00:54:21] [SPEAKER_01]: they do all these things and they tell me there's nothing wrong and I'm sweating and I'm in pain

[00:54:26] [SPEAKER_01]: and I'm telling them no there's pain there's pain right here it's bad and they're telling

[00:54:31] [SPEAKER_01]: me there's nothing wrong with you please go home have a bite to eat whatever and I was

[00:54:37] [SPEAKER_01]: told basically my whole life as a young person my mom would take me to the doctor and he'd just

[00:54:42] [SPEAKER_01]: say oh there's nothing wrong with her and send her home just give her ginger ale and crackers

[00:54:46] [SPEAKER_01]: she's fine after removing myself up north I started again seeing this doctor and he said

[00:54:51] [SPEAKER_01]: well you're gonna need to do something about this and the end option after going to the

[00:54:58] [SPEAKER_01]: highest doses of your pills is to just remove the thyroid and I said I'm not having any

[00:55:04] [SPEAKER_01]: so I stopped the stressing driving to the doctor's appointments and all of the you know get an x-ray

[00:55:13] [SPEAKER_01]: here and do this over there and all of that and I started saying okay I'm gonna have to teach

[00:55:19] [SPEAKER_01]: myself what this body is when you're suicidal you can just go okay so what I'm gonna so if

[00:55:24] [SPEAKER_01]: so what if I die okay this thing I'm in it's a machine they're all using it like a machine

[00:55:30] [SPEAKER_01]: better learn what this machine is I got to figure this out otherwise I don't got nothing and yeah so

[00:55:36] [SPEAKER_01]: now I believe that I have the opportunity to live to 120 in with full cognitive abilities and with

[00:55:43] [SPEAKER_01]: all of the energy I had when I was 30 if I can if I can repair myself enough to get to that

[00:55:50] [SPEAKER_01]: state and I really do believe that so no I'm not gonna die at 50 nor I will yes I will be

[00:55:59] [SPEAKER_01]: at 50 and I will be here for as long as I can after that yeah I want to be here a long good time

[00:56:07] [SPEAKER_01]: I want to see if I can make a dent in this in this society life force not the name of your

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_00]: memoir I don't think but it's not terrible life force the adventures of Angela that's what

[00:56:20] [SPEAKER_00]: it is oh yeah what um 7 47 p.m eastern what's the rest of your evening like I'm probably

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_01]: listen to some more of your podcast because I have not gotten through them all and um I'm really

[00:56:34] [SPEAKER_01]: enjoying listening to other people's explaining what it is they went through and and how

[00:56:42] [SPEAKER_01]: how they are now and all of that I just it gives me this I don't know a sense of hey there

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_01]: was other people who've been through stuff you kind of always know that and you get

[00:56:53] [SPEAKER_01]: you get it here and there but when you get to sit with yourself and you get to listen to someone

[00:56:58] [SPEAKER_01]: that you're not in front of they're not um you're not looking at the facial expressions

[00:57:03] [SPEAKER_01]: or anything and you just get to listen like we get to now listen to them even though they

[00:57:10] [SPEAKER_01]: haven't came to us to talk to us right and I still feel that that's a good unifying thing

[00:57:17] [SPEAKER_01]: like these are my people they know what I'm where I'm at even though we don't know each

[00:57:21] [SPEAKER_01]: we know what's going on you put them together in a way I've been on Facebook that's the first

[00:57:27] [SPEAKER_01]: thing I did my brother put his note on Facebook oh and I stopped using Facebook because it was

[00:57:35] [SPEAKER_01]: just we made a memorial page for him and then my sister and I got into fighting and

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_01]: then she took it down and I just said you know what I'm not doing Facebook anymore

[00:57:45] [SPEAKER_01]: and that helped the support groups that were on there before I shut it down it was difficult

[00:57:52] [SPEAKER_01]: but I was trying to find some support in the groups and it was all just this person killed

[00:57:58] [SPEAKER_01]: themselves and now I'm in grief and it was like yeah I'm in grief too but I want to talk

[00:58:03] [SPEAKER_01]: about why and no one even in like a group for people who again survived someone else committing

[00:58:11] [SPEAKER_01]: suicide were just very upset angry they even come at you with comments like what do you mean

[00:58:18] [SPEAKER_01]: you want to talk about it well yeah I want to talk about what what that person could have

[00:58:23] [SPEAKER_01]: been going through and have you anyone of you really addressed it and maybe you know decided

[00:58:29] [SPEAKER_01]: to make some changes in your life because when they do that there's a little bit of a

[00:58:33] [SPEAKER_01]: disconnect from the people around them too or they wouldn't have done it mostly mostly

[00:58:38] [SPEAKER_01]: this is how I feel yeah you have a naive hope that if you kill yourself the people around you

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_01]: that caused you any pain and suffering or they're going to change those things somehow

[00:58:47] [SPEAKER_01]: that's not how it works right it's our own it's our own mental perception it's an internal

[00:58:54] [SPEAKER_01]: thing when you're hurting and you're you're hoping people might do this or might do that so

[00:59:00] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm glad the adventures of Angela is now included in this podcast and people out there

[00:59:05] [SPEAKER_00]: hear you at some point in the same way that you're hearing them maybe even when you get off this call

[00:59:10] [SPEAKER_00]: I think I've asked all the questions I want to ask but of course I want to give you an opportunity

[00:59:16] [SPEAKER_00]: to add anything else that we didn't talk about or a question I didn't ask or anything else that

[00:59:21] [SPEAKER_01]: comes to mind I really feel that getting out into the middle of the woods helped me a lot

[00:59:26] [SPEAKER_01]: and there's been studies coming out that say that you know getting out into the wilderness

[00:59:31] [SPEAKER_01]: getting out into nature really does the mind good the adventures of Angela are fun and my

[00:59:39] [SPEAKER_01]: new newest premise is the world has ended and now we have to learn to live in nature again

[00:59:45] [SPEAKER_01]: what do we bring with us there's nothing new being manufactured there's no money

[00:59:49] [SPEAKER_01]: there's nothing the world has ended there's just people and what is here now what do we do

[00:59:54] [SPEAKER_01]: how do we get back to nature so yeah so I've been working on that premise and I've been

[01:00:01] [SPEAKER_01]: out here on some crown lands doing some natural buildings some natural water harvesting some

[01:00:08] [SPEAKER_01]: plant identification and whatnot like that and it is I don't know rewarding I mean you feel

[01:00:14] [SPEAKER_01]: really good to to start to know things around you and start to see how nature works

[01:00:20] [SPEAKER_01]: you can learn these things in school but when you're just out in the woods by a river

[01:00:25] [SPEAKER_01]: for a day and a half and you're observing it's a whole nother it's a whole nother ball of wax

[01:00:31] [SPEAKER_01]: and when you have an overactive mind like mine going going going on all sorts of things

[01:00:36] [SPEAKER_01]: it seems to clarify and point me into directions that I need to go and all sorts of things when

[01:00:42] [SPEAKER_01]: like I say sitting in in the middle of town to do this interview just didn't seem like

[01:00:47] [SPEAKER_01]: the right thing to do I needed to have some some woods around me so I think that would help

[01:00:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I think that if there was that option like the option I had to go to my doctor's

[01:00:57] [SPEAKER_01]: where he showed me the key if there was the option for people who wanted to kill themselves

[01:01:01] [SPEAKER_01]: and they said listen I want to kill myself I need away from from my life and I need

[01:01:07] [SPEAKER_01]: somewhere to go we right now we have you know addicts and homeless and a lot of people that

[01:01:13] [SPEAKER_01]: are hurt and sorely bad who need places to go to we have a hard time helping people

[01:01:20] [SPEAKER_01]: in this in this society so I feel that I need to try and create places in nature

[01:01:27] [SPEAKER_01]: that people can come to and and not be afraid to be in nature but allow themselves to de-stress

[01:01:34] [SPEAKER_01]: if if that's how they can do it because I know a lot of people say wow I would love

[01:01:39] [SPEAKER_01]: to just go out in the middle of nature no not even cell phone service as you as you can tell

[01:01:44] [SPEAKER_01]: places where people could go be comfortable and enjoy nature for a bit I also believe

[01:01:51] [SPEAKER_01]: in something some people may not really like what I have to say here in Ontario we have a pill

[01:01:58] [SPEAKER_01]: a suicide assist pill people can make the argument to take this pill to have the doctor

[01:02:07] [SPEAKER_01]: administer it to have a date and time set with your family and your loved ones just be done

[01:02:13] [SPEAKER_01]: with this place regardless of the reason I think that should actually be available

[01:02:20] [SPEAKER_01]: to people I know some people won't won't like that they'll say but wait a minute you you were

[01:02:26] [SPEAKER_01]: going to kill yourself and if you'd have done that you'd be gone and then where would you be

[01:02:29] [SPEAKER_01]: those who really want to die shouldn't have to go through the steps we have to try and go

[01:02:37] [SPEAKER_01]: through to try and kill ourselves it shouldn't be that way to give the person an out from

[01:02:43] [SPEAKER_01]: their life first while still living somewhere anywhere some way somehow some type of program

[01:02:49] [SPEAKER_01]: something where they say okay you don't want to live this life okay but how about we just move

[01:02:54] [SPEAKER_01]: you physically and remove the stressors from your life that are external for a time and

[01:03:00] [SPEAKER_01]: and see and have someone to talk to literally very simple and then work on a plan if the person

[01:03:09] [SPEAKER_01]: says listen I'm out here I've been out here for a week I got away from my life but I am dead

[01:03:16] [SPEAKER_01]: serious I've I've worked it all through these are all my reasons that yada yada yada I don't

[01:03:21] [SPEAKER_01]: want to live anymore and again if they're over the age of 25 which is and I would even push

[01:03:27] [SPEAKER_01]: it to 30 because the limbic brain is not fully developed until the age of 25 and possibly all

[01:03:33] [SPEAKER_01]: the way to the age of 30 so if the thing that is doing all that thinking is not even

[01:03:38] [SPEAKER_01]: fully developed if you know how can you throw a ball without a fully developed arm you know

[01:03:43] [SPEAKER_01]: how can you logically think without a fully developed brain if the person's at that age

[01:03:49] [SPEAKER_01]: or older and they've logically thought it through and they've given themselves an out or two

[01:03:54] [SPEAKER_01]: and they want to go I think a GP should be ready and willing to set up that date you know

[01:04:00] [SPEAKER_01]: with a psychologist yada yada I mean there has to be some regulations I don't like these

[01:04:06] [SPEAKER_01]: words there has to be you know human beings in place to say listen okay you want to kill

[01:04:11] [SPEAKER_01]: yourself okay not oh no oh no you want to kill yourself I get that now what can we do can we

[01:04:17] [SPEAKER_01]: can we see what we can do where are you at what kind of knowledge do you have about what's

[01:04:22] [SPEAKER_01]: going on do you have a gain do you have a why and see if you can work on it with the

[01:04:26] [SPEAKER_01]: person straight up like like human beings and then if they want to go yeah I believe in hey

[01:04:33] [SPEAKER_01]: let's get this person help to go no joke you know there's a pill there's a time they say hey

[01:04:39] [SPEAKER_01]: yeah I'm ready I'm gonna tell my mom I'm gonna tell my so-and-so I'm gonna tell my partner

[01:04:43] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna tell my children be at this place at this time this is the day I'm dying

[01:04:48] [SPEAKER_01]: period now then you got you know you got your weeks or two or three or whatever the time is

[01:04:53] [SPEAKER_01]: to deal with any kind of issues that come up with that but your decision is your decision

[01:04:59] [SPEAKER_01]: if you still want it on that day I don't see why anyone should have to continue to suffer

[01:05:04] [SPEAKER_01]: but no not too many people are going to want to do that because of all of that backlash that

[01:05:11] [SPEAKER_01]: comes from those other human beings that's why we all do it in secret so no I think that the

[01:05:17] [SPEAKER_01]: condition of it is serious enough that's how you know hey everyone this is what's going

[01:05:21] [SPEAKER_01]: on with me there's no help for me I feel this way I'm gonna take a pill because again

[01:05:27] [SPEAKER_01]: we have this pill and apparently it is painless and you do slip off I'm just saying if the if

[01:05:34] [SPEAKER_01]: it exists and that's the most preferable way to go and people who want to go are still stuck

[01:05:41] [SPEAKER_01]: doing unimaginable things to try and go this again is an issue it's a societal red flag

[01:05:49] [SPEAKER_00]: it's a good project I wish you all the all good things well thanks for talking hey man thank

[01:05:56] [SPEAKER_01]: you so much it's been a great talk and I really do appreciate that you've been very welcome I

[01:06:05] [SPEAKER_00]: hope the rest of your night is as I say not sucking I hope you have a wonderful night

[01:06:14] [SPEAKER_00]: as always thanks so much for listening in all of your support special thanks to

[01:06:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Angela up in Ontario thanks Angela if you are a suicide attempt survivor and you'd like to

[01:06:23] [SPEAKER_00]: please reach out hello at suicide noted.com on Facebook or x at suicide noted and you can check

[01:06:29] [SPEAKER_00]: the show notes to learn more about this podcast including our membership and that is all for

[01:06:34] [SPEAKER_00]: episode number 230 stay strong do the best you can I'll talk to you soon